HK3P/WETTI Beretta PX4 Full Size (Bulldog)
Sept 24, 2013 10:34:47 GMT -5
Post by triggs (SABR) on Sept 24, 2013 10:34:47 GMT -5
Full Album Review – HK3P/WE Beretta PX4 Storm
HK3P/WE Tactical Training International (WETTI) “Bulldog” Beretta PX4 Storm (Full Size)
- Real Steel History
- Overview
- Accessories
- Externals review
- Internals review
- Performance
- Final Thoughts and Upgradeability
Real Steel History
The Beretta Px4 Storm is a semi-automatic pistol manufactured by Beretta of Italy and intended for personal defense and law enforcement use. The Px4 uses the same short-recoil, rotating barrel action as the Beretta 8000 Models and uses the same trigger and safety system as the M9/92/96 series, while being completely different in design from either. Light-weight polymer construction with steel inserts, a modular trigger group, fully enclosing slide, Picatinny rail, and changeable backstrap options for the grip are a radical departure from previous Beretta designs. (taken from www.wikipedia.org )
Overview
For anyone that knows me, I am a long time supporter of KWA USA and their products. This is in part due to having experience with almost every major brand name Gas Blow Back (GBB) airsoft company; TM, KJW, WE, HFC, Bell, Western Arms, Tanaka, and so on. So when I say WE (also known as WETTI) was possibly the worst of all the brands I’ve owned, I really do mean it.
So what could possibly possess me to want to buy a new WE? Well it’s simple…it was on sale. I’ve been shopping for a second GBB just to have some variety, and having used most major designs I really wanted something different. The Beretta PX4 is a very futuristic design, and I have an attachment to Italian steel. However, I just couldn’t justify the price of a Tokyo Marui (TM) PX4 since it was still primarily ABS plastic, and a lot of money for something I just wanted for plinking and fun. So I started researching the “WE” version.
Why the quotes? Simply put, WE does not make the PX4. An OEM company known as HK3P is the actual producer of this, and a few of the other, newer, “WE” GBB’s. HK3P makes two of the three variants of the Beretta PX4; the full size and the sub compact model. For whatever reason they do not make the compact model, however, they market the sub compact as the compact. I chose the full size for this review as I wanted to try the unique rotating barrel system (which I will cover later). The sub compact however, uses a tilting barrel system like the Glock’s, 1911’s and so on.
Accessories
One of the reasons I chose the PX4 was its interchangeable backstrap system that allows a user to customize the length of the grip for various length hands. Most current generation pistols (Glock Gen4, Smith & Wesson M&P, Springfield XDm, etc) have the same system since it sells. The backstrap is very simple to swap out on the WE PX4 (even if the instructions aren’t). Simply push up on the “button” or bottom of the hammer spring housing, and the backstrap will pop right off. Then simply install the next size until you find the one you like. The pistol comes with the large strap installed, then it’s simply a matter of comparing the two remaining ones to determine which one is the medium and the small.
The PX4 also comes with a single 25rd magazine. I bought a spare one just in case I start regularly using the pistol during games. The mags come with “Cal 9 Para” and a bullet count engraved on the side and back respectively. Both are a nice touch, but they are just window dressing. The quality of the seals and feeding are the important factors (will be covered later).
One thing I was disappointed not to see was a threaded outer barrel for use with a suppressor, or at least the adapter included in the box.
Externals Review
First thing, the Styrofoam packing the pistol comes in, is terrible. Not only did I find the typical cheap foam broken all over the pistol and in various crevices in the pistol, the box was clearly not meant for the PX4 Bulldog. Parts had been broken off to fit the pistol and the shape was meant for a very different pistol.
Unlike the HK3P PX4, the WE features only a few trademarks and markings to avoid trademark infringements. The lower frame features the only “WE” marking on the entire pistol, as well as a metal plate with a serial number. I do not know if these are unique, but it’s cool to see the added touch. The right side of the frame also has a warning label cast into it.
The one part that I was happy to see was the number of 9mm markings on the replica. I’m not a huge stickler for full trademarks and such, but it’s great to see accurate ones when done.
The strangest thing I found when I opened the box (besides the Styrofoam all over) was the number of “Made in Taiwan” stickers. As you can see from the picture, as well as previous pictures, is the frame, slide, and magazine come with the same sticker applied to them. The exception is the magazine I purchased separate, which did not have one on it at all. My only annoyance came in removing the stickers without leaving major residue. Oh well this is why I have a bottle of Goo Gone I suppose.
The most annoying part of the entire pistol was the threaded outer barrel. Having seen the HK3P reviews, and knowing WE GBB’s in general, I knew it would have an internal threaded outer barrel like their M9/1911 series that could support their adapter that screws in and allows for external threads for a compensator or suppressor. Normally I’d be happy to simply field strip the pistol and remove the offending tip with heat and some elbow grease, but because the tip is added AFTER assembly, the barrel is actually too long to slip out of the slide when field stripped. So instead I managed to gouge the orange insert (obviously) but the outer barrel as well. I was less than amused…
The PX4 features a standard 3-white dot pistol sights, they are not extended for use with a suppressor. The front and rear are both adjustable in case it does not shoot correctly from the factory.
The entire pistol feels like a cross between the Beretta 92FS and a modern polymer/steel pistol (such as a Glock, M&P, XDm, etc). With the large backstrap installed, the trigger feels very similar to my KWA M9 and subsequently the real 92FS.
The PX4 features a safety (and decocker) like the 92FS, as well as a skeletonized hammer. The problem I came across, like many other HK3P owners, is the hammer has a large amount of play when left in the Single Action (SA) position. I took a quick look when I had the pistol apart and it appears the one of the disconnector bars has a large amount of play in it from where it rests against the decocker, this in turn leads to the hammer being able to move between SA and a half-cocked DA (Double Action) position.
The slide release is a perfect length for my particular hand size. It’s not so long that it digs into my thumb and forces me to adjust, but not too short that I can’t easily throw it when reloading.
Just in front of the slide release is the breakdown lever. Unlike the M9/92FS which features an external bar, the PX4 uses a breakdown like a Glock, simply pull down on the bars and the slide pops forward and off.
The PX4 also features a standard 20mm Picatinny rail for mounting flashlights, lasers, or any number of things that use a standard MIL-1913 rail.
Internals Review
Breakdown was fairly simple (after removing the blaze orange tip as mentioned previously). Remove the magazine, rack the slide to push the hammer back, then pull down on the breakdown lever and the slide comes right off. Remove the recoil spring and block, pull out the inner and outer barrel, and done.
The spring feels fairly nice. It gives good feedback and recoil, but is not so hard/soft that it causes performance issues.
The outer barrel actually rides free of the inner barrel to allow for the realistic “barrel twist” of the real PX4. The idea behind the real steel is, the rotating barrel reduces recoil by adding additional resistance and movement into the firing operation. For the airsoft version it adds minor resistance and just looks cool.
The inner barrel features a new hopup adjustment that does not require the pistol be disassembled, unlike WE’s other offerings. Instead you simply have to lock the slide back and twist the dial with a flat blade screwdriver or similar.
The upper slide was fairly clean, but had enough grease/oil to function. One thing I will be watching for is the breaking of the loading nozzle. WE/HK3P is notorious for cheap quality, and their Glock line is well known for breaking the tabs that the nozzle return springs push against. Since it’s not TM spec the entire pistol becomes a paper weight. Hopefully the HK3P PX4 is actually TM spec so in case the nozzle breaks on this one it won’t become a useless weight. But I will be watching for it.
Performance
FPS With Suppressor: 305FPS~ High:344FPS – Low: 273FPS
FPS Without Suppressor: 316FPS~ High: 363FPS – Low: 269FPS
Range: 80-150ft
Honestly I never expect much from a pistol, they are meant for short engagements. That being said I expect even less from anything but a KWA. I sound like a fanboy, but having worked with a number of companies, KWA is one of the few companies that sets a standard for FPS, BB weight, and range/accuracy in a GBB. WE products in general consistently fail to meet any acceptable performance levels.
So to have these results from their PX4 is respectable to say the least. The tests are always conducted with the hopup off, and .20g BB’s. After chrono testing the PX4 I turned up the hopup for my typical .28 weight test and was still able to push them out to a respectable 150ft. Accuracy however, was abysmal at anything past about 50ft. I was certainly not confident in hitting a man sized target at anything past that. I believe a tightbore will greatly improve the PX4’s range and accuracy and fully intend on installing one when I get some time.
Final Thoughts and Upgradeability
As you can see, once the offending orange tip is removed the pistol not only looks correct, but also allows for a suppressor, which I have to say looks and feels very nice on the pistol. The RIS also allows you to mount everything imaginable, I chose to mount my Contour ROAM on the RIS adapter, and will hopefully have some videos soon of the PX4 in action. I really chose the PX4 for the adjustable backstraps, and it is a very nice feature to have for other people that do not have large hands.
Externals Score: 9/10
I was honestly the most impressed by the feeling of quality I got when I first picked up the PX4. This isn’t to say I trust the product completely, I will only endorse the pistol after it has lasted a few games and can prove that it isn’t the “WE” quality I have come to expect.
Internals Score: 9/10
I did like the internals, at least on first impressions I am looking forward to using the pistol. Hopefully it will not suffer from the same weaknesses the HK3P Glock’s are known for. And if it does, it is hopefully 100% TM spec. My only real complaint is the outdated and finicky hopup design. I much prefer the barrel design like in a G36 or KWA GBB’s.
Overall score: 9/10
For the sticklers, I really do wish these had accurate trademarks, at least from an initial impression the pistol is well worth the $100~ but the lack of some trademarks, and inclusion of others makes for an odd balance. I would have preferred to see all markings or none at all. For the price though complaints are negligible. As long as the pistol can prove itself and last longer than a typical WE and/or as long as my KWA’s I would happily give the HK3P/WE PX4 full marks.
© Copyright triggs 2013
HK3P/WE Tactical Training International (WETTI) “Bulldog” Beretta PX4 Storm (Full Size)
- Real Steel History
- Overview
- Accessories
- Externals review
- Internals review
- Performance
- Final Thoughts and Upgradeability
Real Steel History
The Beretta Px4 Storm is a semi-automatic pistol manufactured by Beretta of Italy and intended for personal defense and law enforcement use. The Px4 uses the same short-recoil, rotating barrel action as the Beretta 8000 Models and uses the same trigger and safety system as the M9/92/96 series, while being completely different in design from either. Light-weight polymer construction with steel inserts, a modular trigger group, fully enclosing slide, Picatinny rail, and changeable backstrap options for the grip are a radical departure from previous Beretta designs. (taken from www.wikipedia.org )
Overview
For anyone that knows me, I am a long time supporter of KWA USA and their products. This is in part due to having experience with almost every major brand name Gas Blow Back (GBB) airsoft company; TM, KJW, WE, HFC, Bell, Western Arms, Tanaka, and so on. So when I say WE (also known as WETTI) was possibly the worst of all the brands I’ve owned, I really do mean it.
So what could possibly possess me to want to buy a new WE? Well it’s simple…it was on sale. I’ve been shopping for a second GBB just to have some variety, and having used most major designs I really wanted something different. The Beretta PX4 is a very futuristic design, and I have an attachment to Italian steel. However, I just couldn’t justify the price of a Tokyo Marui (TM) PX4 since it was still primarily ABS plastic, and a lot of money for something I just wanted for plinking and fun. So I started researching the “WE” version.
Why the quotes? Simply put, WE does not make the PX4. An OEM company known as HK3P is the actual producer of this, and a few of the other, newer, “WE” GBB’s. HK3P makes two of the three variants of the Beretta PX4; the full size and the sub compact model. For whatever reason they do not make the compact model, however, they market the sub compact as the compact. I chose the full size for this review as I wanted to try the unique rotating barrel system (which I will cover later). The sub compact however, uses a tilting barrel system like the Glock’s, 1911’s and so on.
Accessories
One of the reasons I chose the PX4 was its interchangeable backstrap system that allows a user to customize the length of the grip for various length hands. Most current generation pistols (Glock Gen4, Smith & Wesson M&P, Springfield XDm, etc) have the same system since it sells. The backstrap is very simple to swap out on the WE PX4 (even if the instructions aren’t). Simply push up on the “button” or bottom of the hammer spring housing, and the backstrap will pop right off. Then simply install the next size until you find the one you like. The pistol comes with the large strap installed, then it’s simply a matter of comparing the two remaining ones to determine which one is the medium and the small.
The PX4 also comes with a single 25rd magazine. I bought a spare one just in case I start regularly using the pistol during games. The mags come with “Cal 9 Para” and a bullet count engraved on the side and back respectively. Both are a nice touch, but they are just window dressing. The quality of the seals and feeding are the important factors (will be covered later).
One thing I was disappointed not to see was a threaded outer barrel for use with a suppressor, or at least the adapter included in the box.
Externals Review
First thing, the Styrofoam packing the pistol comes in, is terrible. Not only did I find the typical cheap foam broken all over the pistol and in various crevices in the pistol, the box was clearly not meant for the PX4 Bulldog. Parts had been broken off to fit the pistol and the shape was meant for a very different pistol.
Unlike the HK3P PX4, the WE features only a few trademarks and markings to avoid trademark infringements. The lower frame features the only “WE” marking on the entire pistol, as well as a metal plate with a serial number. I do not know if these are unique, but it’s cool to see the added touch. The right side of the frame also has a warning label cast into it.
The one part that I was happy to see was the number of 9mm markings on the replica. I’m not a huge stickler for full trademarks and such, but it’s great to see accurate ones when done.
The strangest thing I found when I opened the box (besides the Styrofoam all over) was the number of “Made in Taiwan” stickers. As you can see from the picture, as well as previous pictures, is the frame, slide, and magazine come with the same sticker applied to them. The exception is the magazine I purchased separate, which did not have one on it at all. My only annoyance came in removing the stickers without leaving major residue. Oh well this is why I have a bottle of Goo Gone I suppose.
The most annoying part of the entire pistol was the threaded outer barrel. Having seen the HK3P reviews, and knowing WE GBB’s in general, I knew it would have an internal threaded outer barrel like their M9/1911 series that could support their adapter that screws in and allows for external threads for a compensator or suppressor. Normally I’d be happy to simply field strip the pistol and remove the offending tip with heat and some elbow grease, but because the tip is added AFTER assembly, the barrel is actually too long to slip out of the slide when field stripped. So instead I managed to gouge the orange insert (obviously) but the outer barrel as well. I was less than amused…
The PX4 features a standard 3-white dot pistol sights, they are not extended for use with a suppressor. The front and rear are both adjustable in case it does not shoot correctly from the factory.
The entire pistol feels like a cross between the Beretta 92FS and a modern polymer/steel pistol (such as a Glock, M&P, XDm, etc). With the large backstrap installed, the trigger feels very similar to my KWA M9 and subsequently the real 92FS.
The PX4 features a safety (and decocker) like the 92FS, as well as a skeletonized hammer. The problem I came across, like many other HK3P owners, is the hammer has a large amount of play when left in the Single Action (SA) position. I took a quick look when I had the pistol apart and it appears the one of the disconnector bars has a large amount of play in it from where it rests against the decocker, this in turn leads to the hammer being able to move between SA and a half-cocked DA (Double Action) position.
The slide release is a perfect length for my particular hand size. It’s not so long that it digs into my thumb and forces me to adjust, but not too short that I can’t easily throw it when reloading.
Just in front of the slide release is the breakdown lever. Unlike the M9/92FS which features an external bar, the PX4 uses a breakdown like a Glock, simply pull down on the bars and the slide pops forward and off.
The PX4 also features a standard 20mm Picatinny rail for mounting flashlights, lasers, or any number of things that use a standard MIL-1913 rail.
Internals Review
Breakdown was fairly simple (after removing the blaze orange tip as mentioned previously). Remove the magazine, rack the slide to push the hammer back, then pull down on the breakdown lever and the slide comes right off. Remove the recoil spring and block, pull out the inner and outer barrel, and done.
The spring feels fairly nice. It gives good feedback and recoil, but is not so hard/soft that it causes performance issues.
The outer barrel actually rides free of the inner barrel to allow for the realistic “barrel twist” of the real PX4. The idea behind the real steel is, the rotating barrel reduces recoil by adding additional resistance and movement into the firing operation. For the airsoft version it adds minor resistance and just looks cool.
The inner barrel features a new hopup adjustment that does not require the pistol be disassembled, unlike WE’s other offerings. Instead you simply have to lock the slide back and twist the dial with a flat blade screwdriver or similar.
The upper slide was fairly clean, but had enough grease/oil to function. One thing I will be watching for is the breaking of the loading nozzle. WE/HK3P is notorious for cheap quality, and their Glock line is well known for breaking the tabs that the nozzle return springs push against. Since it’s not TM spec the entire pistol becomes a paper weight. Hopefully the HK3P PX4 is actually TM spec so in case the nozzle breaks on this one it won’t become a useless weight. But I will be watching for it.
Performance
FPS With Suppressor: 305FPS~ High:344FPS – Low: 273FPS
FPS Without Suppressor: 316FPS~ High: 363FPS – Low: 269FPS
Range: 80-150ft
Honestly I never expect much from a pistol, they are meant for short engagements. That being said I expect even less from anything but a KWA. I sound like a fanboy, but having worked with a number of companies, KWA is one of the few companies that sets a standard for FPS, BB weight, and range/accuracy in a GBB. WE products in general consistently fail to meet any acceptable performance levels.
So to have these results from their PX4 is respectable to say the least. The tests are always conducted with the hopup off, and .20g BB’s. After chrono testing the PX4 I turned up the hopup for my typical .28 weight test and was still able to push them out to a respectable 150ft. Accuracy however, was abysmal at anything past about 50ft. I was certainly not confident in hitting a man sized target at anything past that. I believe a tightbore will greatly improve the PX4’s range and accuracy and fully intend on installing one when I get some time.
Final Thoughts and Upgradeability
As you can see, once the offending orange tip is removed the pistol not only looks correct, but also allows for a suppressor, which I have to say looks and feels very nice on the pistol. The RIS also allows you to mount everything imaginable, I chose to mount my Contour ROAM on the RIS adapter, and will hopefully have some videos soon of the PX4 in action. I really chose the PX4 for the adjustable backstraps, and it is a very nice feature to have for other people that do not have large hands.
Externals Score: 9/10
I was honestly the most impressed by the feeling of quality I got when I first picked up the PX4. This isn’t to say I trust the product completely, I will only endorse the pistol after it has lasted a few games and can prove that it isn’t the “WE” quality I have come to expect.
Internals Score: 9/10
I did like the internals, at least on first impressions I am looking forward to using the pistol. Hopefully it will not suffer from the same weaknesses the HK3P Glock’s are known for. And if it does, it is hopefully 100% TM spec. My only real complaint is the outdated and finicky hopup design. I much prefer the barrel design like in a G36 or KWA GBB’s.
Overall score: 9/10
For the sticklers, I really do wish these had accurate trademarks, at least from an initial impression the pistol is well worth the $100~ but the lack of some trademarks, and inclusion of others makes for an odd balance. I would have preferred to see all markings or none at all. For the price though complaints are negligible. As long as the pistol can prove itself and last longer than a typical WE and/or as long as my KWA’s I would happily give the HK3P/WE PX4 full marks.
© Copyright triggs 2013